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-   Custom Dodge Ram Performance Mods - Engine - 8.0 Liter V10 (http://www.ramforumz.com/forumdisplay.php?f=87)
-   -   Making my V10 perform better/Viper V10 Parts? (http://www.ramforumz.com/showthread.php?t=93828)

DennisMotorsports 10-08-2011 07:35 PM

Making my V10 perform better/Viper V10 Parts?
 
Hey guys, I have a V10 4WD that I use mostly for towing and around town in the winter. I got the truck for almost free a few years ago (one of those "I don't know whats wrong with it...If you can fix it you can have it" kinda deals; needed a thermostat, and timing cover tightened up). It has pretty high miles, over 170K, and I'm thinking about putting some money into it, and making it perform a little better.
I can't seem to find much good information anywhere about what kind of upgrades to do, so maybe I can compile some information along the way.
Thanks in advance for any information you can give me.

Is there a good source online for V10 specialized performance parts?

Where to start: obviously the first things to look at are a CAI, Headers/Exhaust, ECU chip, etc.

Does anyone have any good experiences with a particular brand CAI? How about throttle body spacers?

What about headers? I know i can find all kinds of shorty headers on Ebay, but is any one particular brand better than another? I only really drive it under extreme conditions, so I don't want them to fall apart after a year...Or who knows of a good brand of long tube headers? I couldn't find much for long tubes on ebay.

ECU? I read about a Mopar Performance ECU for the V10. Are those available anywhere? Or should I go with an ebay chip? Do things like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PERFO...item58900ea0c6 even work?

Injectors? I have an '01 so I have the "upgraded factory" injectors, but is there a common alternative that would increase performance?

I've been curious since I got my truck about parts interchangeabilty with the V10 Viper engine. Obviously they are radically different engines, but has anyone tried to use Viper parts in their truck? I know the 8.0L Viper has the same block as the Ram, so in theory, most of the parts should be bolt on/in replacements.
Does anyone know if the crank and rods are different from Viper to Ram? I know the Viper has higher compression. Is this strictly because of the pistions?
What about the heads? The Viper has different heads than the truck. Seeing as the block is the same, these heads should bolt on, no? Without the higher compression, would the heads even help?
Intake? Will the Viper intake bolt on?
If I did any of these changes, would the Truck ECU be able to handle it? What options do I have for Engine Management? In RI, I don't need to pass emissions because of the high GVW, but I do need to retain the (an) OBD II computer.

Basically my question is do any parts from a Viper engine bolt on to make my truck perform better?

If anyone has any idea of an answer to these questions, please let me know. If you're going to say anything about wasting my time trying to make the V10 better, please don't bother posting. Sorry if these questions come up often (it doesn't seem like they do) and bear with me as a newb to the forum. I've done a fair bit of research, and I didn't find many answers on my own.
Thanks
David

RedRam10 10-15-2011 12:51 AM

Hi, don't have an answer, but I can offer to :icon_bump: this back to the top!

HemiLonestar 10-15-2011 12:15 PM

The Viper engine block is aluminum, while the truck version is cast iron. As far as I know, there are no interchangeable parts between the truck and Viper engines. The truck version stays very close to it's original roots, which is a really long 360. I can't find it, but on one of the forums a guy put a V10 into late 90's Ram and did some upgrades to get about 400hp. This involved some head work, upgraded cam and custom tuning. The SCT with a custom tune worked on his.

DennisMotorsports 10-17-2011 09:19 AM

Thanks for the response! Are you sure even the original (gen 1) Viper had an aluminum block? Everything I have read about the differences has failed to mention that.
From allpar:
Unique features of the Viper version of the V-10, versus the V10 truck engine, included a low-profile cross-ram intake with dual throttle bodies, the manifolds, oil pan, heads, and accessory drive; the compression ratio was raised, the pistons lightened, the maximum engine speed increased, the valves enlarged, the rods and crank strengthened. In the end, few components were shared with the truck engine.

I would like to know what these few components are. Is there a good place to call to get information like this straight from Dodge? The tech guys at my local dealership don't ever seem to know anything useful....

HemiLonestar 10-20-2011 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DennisMotorsports (Post 637708)
Thanks for the response! Are you sure even the original (gen 1) Viper had an aluminum block? Everything I have read about the differences has failed to mention that.
From allpar:
Unique features of the Viper version of the V-10, versus the V10 truck engine, included a low-profile cross-ram intake with dual throttle bodies, the manifolds, oil pan, heads, and accessory drive; the compression ratio was raised, the pistons lightened, the maximum engine speed increased, the valves enlarged, the rods and crank strengthened. In the end, few components were shared with the truck engine.

I would like to know what these few components are. Is there a good place to call to get information like this straight from Dodge? The tech guys at my local dealership don't ever seem to know anything useful....

At the time the Viper was being prototyped, Chrysler owned Lamborghini. They had Lambo cast the engine in aluminum since they had experience with long aluminum V engines. Since they didn't need the weight savings, nor does aluminum hold up particularly well for a heavy duty work engine, they left the truck version cast iron. Plus this was cheaper. Found that thread, give this a read:
http://dodgetruckworld.tenmagazines....d=147920&pos=1

Gen1dak 10-26-2011 12:33 AM

Also from Allpar:
The Italian automakerís expertise in aluminum was also tapped, since the Viper had an aluminum block to save roughly 150 pounds of weight. Legendary Chrysler engine designer Willem Weertman, who had designed the LA V8 the Viper was based on, was called in to help out.

Also interesting is that some creative work made for a V10 that was only 4 inches longer than a 360.

erm 10-26-2011 12:13 PM

As stated, the Viper engine and the cast iron V10 truck engine do not have common parts. You want some Viper performance? Swap in a Viper motor.

But, since that's probably not a good economic solution, I do have a suggestion on the PCM. Contact B&G Performance. They have performance PCM's for a LOT of cars and trucks.

Regarding exhaust, you can either investigate Kooks and ARH for a long tube header application or have some built to your engine's specifications.

For the V10, your CAI options are a bit limited but I'd look at K&N for an open filter type or AFE for a semi-enclosed unit or Volant for a totally closed unit. You'll need to know the OD of your TB inlet.

Forget about throttle body spacers...just forget about them.

Opening up the intake and exhaust is a time honored and effective modification. In your case, I'd use a local exhaust shop to install a nice, true dual system with a crossover pipe and the mufflers of your choice.

Good luck with the mods!!!

HemiLonestar 10-28-2011 12:41 PM

Get some head work done. Raise your compression (I believe stock is around 8:1). Figure out what gears, converter and how you want to use the truck. Take this info to get the right cam. Custom programming with a good exhaust. Then have fun!

EV3RGREEN 10-05-2012 07:00 PM

I would like to add some interesting information to the "few components shared" part of this thread.

This guy has claimed to swap 3rd Gen Viper heads onto the truck engine. As well as the intake manifold.

Source:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/219888...lity-4d/page-2

He's even got pictures of it.

99 V10 12-12-2012 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EV3RGREEN (Post 903071)
I would like to add some interesting information to the "few components shared" part of this thread.

This guy has claimed to swap 3rd Gen Viper heads onto the truck engine. As well as the intake manifold.

Source:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/219888...lity-4d/page-2

He's even got pictures of it.

An interesting read. Thanks


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