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Transmition

5K views 26 replies 4 participants last post by  ramvan2500 
#1 ·
Do they sell performance kits for my transmition for my 99?
 
#4 ·
Better response starts with a better transmission! But working with what you have since it's a 1999 then some of the changes are going to be done to the ECM, then firmer shifts you can use a shift kit which I am against but it's up to you, more torque from a transmission ok then you will need to change planetaries and ring gears for that so you have different gearing. But remember the torque converter multiplies torque at lower speeds so you can put a different torque converter on which will help with lanuch. Ummm, as far as getting a firmer shift is concerned you would have to change a couple valves in the valve body for timing which is what a shift kit really issue or you can change things like the line pressure, kickdown lever, change the clutches, change the shift point make it a little higher so you can get as much out of whatever gear you're in.
But just buy a shift kit and call it a day, like I said I'm against it but I don't want to get to in depth with chaning components because I could write a book lol
 
#5 ·
Well since the last time we spoke I completed my transmissison course and am VERY FAMILIAR with my tranny so tearing it down is no proble so where and wat should I get for planetary gears and same goes for ring gears also wat stall converter and suggested line pressure and y not a shift kit
 
#6 ·
Well it's good you took a course, very nice to see some people expand there minds. It also makes my job easier :p

Anyways speaking in terms of planetary gears it's a science!
For example the carrier, you have a choice of aluminum or steel, the benefits are of there materials, steel is stronger but heavier, aluminum lighter yet weaker then the steel. Then the number of planets, the more planets you have then the more torsional strength of the planet so the more load you can place on the planet, the issue with having more planets generally more then 3 is that it may not be very precise and there can be some vibrations from the planet now of course with wear the planets will wear down and begin to spin more truely and vibration will decrease.
Also if it's a stright cut or angle cut, and how many degrees is the angle, straight cuts are stronger but produce more noise, angle cuts the opposite less noise at the expensense of durability of course you can substitute with more planets OR having it cut at a lesser angle say 15 degrees. I could literally sit down for hours with a white board and show you designs, materials, anything and everything. The stock planets are simpson style planetaries well most are.


I personally am happy with the 6 planet aluminum carriers, they hold up well, even when towing! Generally you will want to switch to steel if you do some serious towing or any type of racing mostly drag racing.

The next thing you want to look into is the overrunning clutch or commonly the sprag, you want to change out the cam (outer race) and get one that is a bolt in, SMR transmissions sells a kit for the 46,47, and 48. The reason being is because the stock cam is just a press fit and if you shock load the transmission (loss of traction then traction) the cam could easily break loose and rip the case apart.

If you go into anything performance like that you are going to want to replace the forward drum and direct drum, if the overrunning clutch was to fail then the forward drum would spin 2.2 times as fast as it's input speed which would cause the transmission to explode which is EXTREMELY dangerous!

As far as ring gears, the stock ring gears are usually a medium carbon steel and are heat treated. They have to be in order to support the load.

As for the converter, you can't just shell out a stall speed, it's going to be based on so many variables hp, torque, the rpm of which they are produced, vehicle weight, gearing. It's pretty complicated, but you can think of it like this, if you race use a higher stall speed, if you tow or just a daily driver a low stall speed will do fine. I run a 2000-2200 stall and it gets the job done.

As for line pressure, it's going to depend on variables like anything. Math had to be used to engineer the machine so math or atleast some logic is going to be used to modify it, that's if you want it right.

The reason for no shift kits, because most of the kits require you to drill holes in the valve body. Now doing simple valve changes like sonnax manual valve, regulator valve, and throttle valve is ok because those are to correct common issues more then affect the shift timing.

You can change line pressure to increase the shifts, I can't tell you what PSI to set anything to because the line pressure changes in relationship to the pump and the valve body itself, this is why there are test ports on the outside of the bell housing in addition to diagnostics.

If you want my opinion on clutchs, alto red eagle and use there kolene steels. I won't use anything else they are the best period dot.

Seal kits, transtec is all I use, there kits are pretty complete and they aren't expensive at all so why not.

Another thing I do it's odd but: For the front band I use borg warner and the reason why is because of a few reasons inexpensive, thick friction material layer so last longer less replacement, and have more surface area. Then for the rear band I use raybestos hi energy, why because it works and I don't use reverse as often as my drive range so wear to the drum won't be significant at all. The original bands in the 95 and earlier use to be made by advanced friction materials who was actually bought out by raybestos in later 95 early 96.

Stay away from kevlar or carbon bands unless you have the money to replace drums.

Bushings, use clevite cannot go wrong with them for dam sure!

if you want my fluid opinion, this is just my opinion: Valvoline ATF+4 it costs a pretty penny but all atf+4 does!

another thing i do is install an external cooler of course because these tf's run pretty dam hot! also remove the anti-flow valve helps increase flow and reduce the risk of overheating due to a lack of fluid.

there is just so much I could write about the torque flite, great transmission but if you're going to use it in competition performance it needs some work, other then that I have seen 727's behind vehicles with over 1000HP. another issue is the number system, they say 46rh right so 600 ft-lbs but remember the torque converter multiplies torque of course it's in proportion to speed so as the TC speeds up the multiplication decreases and vice versa. this is something many people forget about is the torque converter multiplying torque, now of course you can exceed the limit but for how long is the question.

anyways you ever have any questions you know you can always ask me im more then happy to answer questions or lend a hand anytime, transmissions are something i really enjoy. i work only with torqueflites so im limited.
 
#7 ·
Hell yea thx and idk wat modle I have the 46 47...idk there pretty much the same besides a couple common changes right ...and wat set up should I go with talking planetary steel aluminum spra TC overdrive and the lil things to acumulator piston ect. if it's a daily driver and for that time I roll up on some Kid in their civic I want the most out of it also later shifts?
 
#8 ·
Well like I said I have always make out well with Aluminum Carriers, steel carriers are the best option if you do some serious duty towing and if the transmission is going behind a 600+ HP dragster. As for the overrunning clutch outer race, the stock is fine for daily driving and light to mid duty towing. But if you are going to do any type of extreme racing, heavy duty towing, or any burn outs you're going to want to get the SMR Bolt-On overrunning clutch outer race. But even with the SMR race, you still should refrain from doing burn outs in D range 1st gear. There is a trick you can and should do if you do a burn out with the torque flites to prevent case damage due to that race. What you do is start out in Manual first gear, the reason for manual 1st gear is the rear band will engage onto the rear drum so then the overrunning clutch isn't in use. So what you would do is start out in manual 1st gear and then shift to manual 2nd gear while doing the burn out, this ways when you gain traction you don't risk tearing the case apart during the burn out. If you are going to build the transmission for racing then you should use a kevlar rear band because it seems to have less slip but at the cost of drum surface wear.

But daily driver how it's setup now is fine just refrain from burn outs. Or if you must do a burn out do it in manual 1st gear and while in mid burnout shift it into manual 2nd.

shift points can be changed using a shift kit or you can adjust the throttle valve cable for later shifts, however if you take the throttle valve cable adjustment route driving around town will be annoying because how the transmission will shift, basically around town if you want to pass someone you have to damn near floor that pedal.

For daily driving the truck in stock form is perfect, if you plan on racing then it's going to need work all over the truck trans, engine, rear end, so on...

But in order for me to give recommendations of parts and modifications to the transmission I would want to know exactly what the truck is used for, if you are going to be racing, towing, or just going to be some sunday driver. Of course some people I being one of them like to build the transmission so it has racing parts but mainly for the durability, if that is what you want then no problem.

As for the accumulators, and pistons, there is a wide selection. Some people sell custom made ones that will give you tall tall shifts, then some that are almost leak free. But before you can even build a transmission you have to inspect the bell housing to make sure that it is acceptable for rebuilding, many bell housings have scoring and scuffs in the accumulator and servo bores.
 
#9 ·
It is going to be used for daily driver and raceing also eventually a stroker and I'm doin the tranny first because it feels/seems like when going from 2-3 and 3-4 gears it up shifts down shifts and up shifts again simotaniously when I geton the gas 75-100% throttle
 
#10 ·
Keep you eye on the tach to check for up/down shifts. Provided the transmission isn't immediately shifting into 4th after 3rd then the transmissions sounds fine, but you have to make sure it isn't jumping gears back and forth, if it does keep jumping gears 4,3,4,3,4,3 then you probably have an issue with the motor or torque converter more then the transmission but I can't promise that unless I drive it.

As for building the transmission for racing and daily driving, the transmissions in these trucks aren't made for racing but can be however it's going to be limiting. But I can make you up a list of parts and modifications no problem, I would like to know how much you are willing to spend though because if you want all out racing then it's going to cost your some bucks but if you want something like 15% racing and 85% regular driving then not a problem.
 
#11 ·
This is great information Ramvan2500. I'm one of those guys you call "knowledge of many...master of none." As I get older I still want to learn more and work with my hands. Just learn HVAC over a year ago, planning on taking classes in welding this fall, then would like to learn and rebuild my own transmissions. Just like doing my own work on things. Problem is you become everybodies friend but thats ok...I like to help people out.
 
#12 ·
Thank you. Welding is pretty fun to learn, you could teach yourself of course go to harbor freight, buy one of those electric flux core welders. It's a start!
HVAC is good field to be in, especially since summer is right around the corner. But umm, if you want to learn to rebuild transmissions I'm here to help if you need any. Hect you can pick my brain about anything, anytime!
 
#13 ·
Yea so I went to go and monitor the tach like u said ramvan and it's doing something different now now it's shifting late through all gears just CRUSING and when I get on it it passes the red line and hits the rev limiter at 5500 RPMS I have to let off the gas for it to shift and it bangs on the rev limiter 3-5 times if u let it is that the oil pres solenoid and is it possible to do a 50/50 race/daily driver internals with my trany and if so can I have par numbers I know ur notorious for trannys but if it's not possible can I have part numbers for trany rebuild parts to make it as much like a race tranny as possible but still b able to run as daily driver? Thanks ramvan!
 
#14 ·
Oh yes of course, I will give you the parts and there part numbers for a daily driver rebuild that allows you to do light street racing, you won't be able to throw 400HP behind it without snapping a shaft or hub but you can stomp down on that pedal over and over and over and over and not have to worry about a thing.

I will begin making a list tomorrow morning and probably have it up tomorrow night, it's a relatively short list. I do have a couple of questions just so I give you the correct parts, What year is the truck and what model transmission do you have, I think you once told me it's a 46RE???
I need to know year and model because different models and years used a different number and thickness of friction discs and friction plates.

What is the predicted HP you are putting into it? Do you plan on doing many many burn outs? Do you expect to tow often or moderately? Are you going to be doing high speed racing?

I have to get a tach, I have my heart set on a autometer 5" with a shift light and built in memory. But thats almost 200 bucks! Ouch...
 
#15 ·
Tach is cool I need one right. AND yes towing every now and then nothing to big and it's stock engine right now and it's a 1999 5.2 I'm not sure the moddle trans but on the info sticker under the hood the code for the trans is (DGB, STD DUTY 4SPD AUTO TRANS) I think it's a 46 or 47 I'm not 100% sure but if u need one ofe the letters off the vin that's fine and I eventually want to drop in a 5.9 stroker but by then I will b wanting to switch up the tranny even more and yea burnouts when I want so yea the capability to do that I also have 4:10 gears in it if u need that info aswell.
 
#16 ·
The 46 series transmission is actually very strong transmission, remember that a transmission is rated x ft-lbs that is constant load under shock load conditions you can reach almost 5 times the constant.

But I'm very sure you have a 46RE, finding a 47 series isn't common except in the 2500 series and behind the 5.9L most times if it's the 5.9L and 47 combination it's in a 2500 series. But this information is good enough, umm how much you plan on spending?
 
#17 ·
I know I'm going to b rebuilding a tranny so it's not gona b cheap but I don't wanna buy 24k gold parts I'm fine with sterling silver u get wat I mean not top TOP of the line but good enough for durability reliable and and handle some raceing
 
#21 ·
Ok here is the beginning of the list, this is for a 46RH/RE.
I am going to list part number and description.
From www.makcotransmissionparts.com
22002E Overhaul Kit Transtec
22030EC Bushing Kit (Contains Clevite Bushings)
M465TJ Transjel Assembly Lube
D12410C Neutral Safety Switch
B220022A Front Flex Band Borg Warner
A22024B Rear Band Raybestos
A22936 3-4 Shift Accumulator Spring
A22853 Front Clutch Spacer Cushion
A22654A Sprag, 727 / 518, 14 Spring & roller
A12650 Sprag, A500 / A518 / A618 Overdrive clutch 1990-UP
12271 Bearing, A500 / A518 / A618 Output Shaft Front
22272A Bearing, A727 / A518 / A618. Output shaft (rear)
D12222 Bearing, A518 / A618, Overdrive inner sprag to output shaft
22200E Thrust washer kit, A518 / A618, 1990-2002 ONLY IF YOU NEED TO REPLACE THEM
A22582EK Front Planet Kit, 5 Pinion (Retrofits 90-Up) , A518 / 618,



Now for the frictions and steels the quantity and thickness will vary based on application.
But they're Alto Brand, Red Eagle Frictions and Kolene Steels But here we go...

027721K STEEL, 7
027723K STEEL, 3
028701L STEEL, 6
028740PL FRICTION, 3
028742 FRICTION, 4
027746 FRICTION, 4
027744 FRICTION, 8

You will also need to get a filter

External Transmission Cooler

The proper electronics other than the neutral safety switch,
12415B Sensor, Governor pressure, (Transducer), A518, A618 (96-99), A500 (96-99)
12432A Solenoid, A500 / A518 governor pressure SOLENOID, 1993-UP
12420B Solenoid, A500 / A518 / A618 Dual OD & TCC

Removal of Anti-Drain Back Valve

Upgrade the rear planet to a 6 pinion, there is a steel carrier and an aluminum carrier, I have always done well with an aluminum carrier, only need steel if you are driving some serious HP into it.
I got mine on ebay because it's less expensive, makco sells it too!

You need to replace the manual valve with the sonnax one, 22771-09

Replace pressure regulator valve with sonnax, 22771A-02K

Replace overrunning clutch outer race with a bolt in one or you can machine the original one so you can run bolts into it. http://smrtrans.tripod.com/smrtransmissionsintro/id17.html

If the truck is 2WD you need to get the slip yoke boot seal, part number 7300S can get it at autozone.


Be sure to take apart the transmission first so assess damages etc...
There are some more parts I may throw at you, oh yea and be sure to get a better torque converter!

Any questions, ask please.
 
#23 ·
That's because the part numbers for the frictions and steels are manufacture part numbers and makcotransmissionparts.com doesn't list all of the frictions and steels because there are so many, you would have to get a manufacture parts catalog and select what you need and give makco the manufacture part number and they order it from the manufacture. The reason for this is because companies like alto and raybestos don't sell directly to the end user, it's through a distributor.

You should get the planetary I listed for the front, the rear planet just get the 6 pinion aluminum aftermarket, it's like 90 bucks on ebay, I have it in my 46RH and it does extremely well no slop, no delays, no noise.

You will have to pickout what torque converter you want, try to aim for something with a stall of about 2000-2200 RPM. You need a converter if it's a 5.2L then you need a converter that is neutral balance. If you remove the converter on the truck now there will be a 3 digit code written on the converter, that is a TC code you can use that code to select the torque converter you need.

But those part numbers are all manufacture part numbers, the issue with just entering in the part number somewhere is the fact that many transmission parts aren't exactly sold at the local autozone, many parts are restricted to professionals. Basically I'm saying is you need to know what you're doing in order to get to where you're going, But that is why I'm here.

For parts that aren't listed on there website just email them the part number and they will tell you how much. They are a distributor, things like clutches are shipped directly from the manufacture to you, makco doesn't stock many of those parts because there is literally a million different combinations between sizes and material alone.
 
#24 ·
Ram van man where / what site can I find the clutches and steals also a bolt in overrunning clutch,and a front flex band Borg Warner? I got all the rest of the parts in yesterday.
 
#26 ·
Ramvan I rebuilt my tranny and it will not come out of first tore it back down and the drum next to the front pump was grooved and I know that could stop it from the band catching and letting the transmission slip but just in case wat r the valve body adjustment specs and both band specks another tranny tech told me its proble in the valve body since I replaced those valves u told me to....many I got the adjustment wrong any other thoughts?
 
#27 ·
If you go to sonnax website and put the part number in for those valves it will have a page where you can download the installation instructions which have all the steps and measurements WITH PHOTOS! to properly calibrate those new valves. There really SHOULDN'T be ANY reason for calibration because they are direct replacement parts. If you aren't able to leave 1st gear and the direct drum is grooved then it may be the front servo it could be leaking OR it could be getting stuck, sonnax has a repair for that. Matter fact these transmissions are famous for there 2-3 long slide shifts and thats because the fluid leaks between the servo pin and cover. If you have anymore questions try emailing me because I have been having trouble getting onto the site, I think they blocked my IP or something, probably since I travel often. It could be the governor valves in the valve body but the groove on the direct drum worries me, if you can email me a photo so I have a better idea of what kind of groove that would help. I will PM you my email if you don't have it.
 
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