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  #11  
Old 08-13-2013, 01:27 AM
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randomid25 randomid25 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mexi View Post
let see same tq with less hp. pretty simple math.
less tow rating then the hemi too. so fuel will be the only thing.
tuned? 3 years from now maybe.
I drive a lifted ram with big heavy mud tires fuel isnt my concern or id buy a corrola.

paper horsepower expert huh?.... power to weight ratio its been around awhile
More tq than a hemi at lower rpm means more HP where you spend all your time driving. The eco diesel weighs about 20lbs more than a hemi so the weight difference is pretty much moot.

There are already tunes available for the euro engine which uses the same Bosch ecm, so I highly doubt it will take 3 years. http://www.bluesparkautomotive.com/carspecs2?carid=6585 314 max hp/ 527 max tq with just a tuning module out of a 3 liter.

You drive a lifted truck with big tires, wouldn't you like to get better mileage with the life and big tires than the hemi can get? Not to mention a gas truck with big tires drives like crap without the gearing change to accommodate said tires, always hunting for gears, revving up and bogging down when it upshifts. Granted, this shouldn't be such an issue with a tight ratio 8 SPD trans.
The eco tows more than an equally equipped hemi, 9200lbs vs 9050 in a 2wd long bed regular cab configuration with 3.55 gears. It will out tow the hemi completely if a 3.92 gear set is an option when it goes into production.

Lastly, in your words, "fuel is the only thing". The only thing is a HUGE thing! An eco should beat a hemi with the same configuration by 5mpg, going off the info currently available. Not to mention that the resale of the diesel will be much higher than a hemi truck (based off a trend with 2500&3500 diesel vs. Equal gas models).

Forgive me if I fail to see where you have proved your point.

To the other people in this thread, I realize the diesel won't be for everyone. I've driven hemis. I've owned gas trucks. I've owned diesels. I think the hemi is a fine engine. I just have a problem with someone making ignorant statements about something they haven't driven or even seen yet.
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  #12  
Old 08-13-2013, 08:47 AM
crabjoe crabjoe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randomid25 View Post
More tq than a hemi at lower rpm means more HP where you spend all your time driving. The eco diesel weighs about 20lbs more than a hemi so the weight difference is pretty much moot.

There are already tunes available for the euro engine which uses the same Bosch ecm, so I highly doubt it will take 3 years. http://www.bluesparkautomotive.com/carspecs2?carid=6585 314 max hp/ 527 max tq with just a tuning module out of a 3 liter.

You drive a lifted truck with big tires, wouldn't you like to get better mileage with the life and big tires than the hemi can get? Not to mention a gas truck with big tires drives like crap without the gearing change to accommodate said tires, always hunting for gears, revving up and bogging down when it upshifts. Granted, this shouldn't be such an issue with a tight ratio 8 SPD trans.
The eco tows more than an equally equipped hemi, 9200lbs vs 9050 in a 2wd long bed regular cab configuration with 3.55 gears. It will out tow the hemi completely if a 3.92 gear set is an option when it goes into production.

Lastly, in your words, "fuel is the only thing". The only thing is a HUGE thing! An eco should beat a hemi with the same configuration by 5mpg, going off the info currently available. Not to mention that the resale of the diesel will be much higher than a hemi truck (based off a trend with 2500&3500 diesel vs. Equal gas models).

Forgive me if I fail to see where you have proved your point.

To the other people in this thread, I realize the diesel won't be for everyone. I've driven hemis. I've owned gas trucks. I've owned diesels. I think the hemi is a fine engine. I just have a problem with someone making ignorant statements about something they haven't driven or even seen yet.

What are you talking about?

I agree with you completely!!
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  #13  
Old 08-13-2013, 09:42 AM
Tshepp Tshepp is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mexi View Post
let see same tq with less hp. pretty simple math.
less tow rating then the hemi too. so fuel will be the only thing.
tuned? 3 years from now maybe.
I drive a lifted ram with big heavy mud tires fuel isnt my concern or id buy a corrola.

paper horsepower expert huh?.... power to weight ratio its been around awhile
Thanks for the replies but didnt wanna ruffle any feathers

I can't imagine that 35s would put too much strain on the big bad Hemi, 37s maybe are a little much but I ran 35s on my Hummer h3 and if that can turn them the Ram will easily spin em...

I would love to think the Eco Diesel could be tuned like other diesels for more power/tq but I really dont anticipate that being available for quite a while and no one is even sure what the gains would be. I guess when I start to think about the break-even point between the two, it is pretty significant. I would expect that the extra cost of the Eco Diesel over the Hemi, plus the extra cost in diesel fuel would yield a fairly high break-even point.
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  #14  
Old 08-13-2013, 09:54 AM
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Donlen updated their site yesterday.

http://www.donlen.com/production-trucks-chrysler.aspx

3.0L V6 Turbo Diesel Engine (EXF) - 10/07/13

3.0L V6 Turbo Diesel Engine (EXF) with 3.92 Axle Ratio (DMH) - 01/13/14
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  #15  
Old 08-13-2013, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randomid25 View Post
More tq than a hemi at lower rpm means more HP where you spend all your time driving. The eco diesel weighs about 20lbs more than a hemi so the weight difference is pretty much moot.

There are already tunes available for the euro engine which uses the same Bosch ecm, so I highly doubt it will take 3 years. http://www.bluesparkautomotive.com/carspecs2?carid=6585 314 max hp/ 527 max tq with just a tuning module out of a 3 liter.

You drive a lifted truck with big tires, wouldn't you like to get better mileage with the life and big tires than the hemi can get? Not to mention a gas truck with big tires drives like crap without the gearing change to accommodate said tires, always hunting for gears, revving up and bogging down when it upshifts. Granted, this shouldn't be such an issue with a tight ratio 8 SPD trans.
The eco tows more than an equally equipped hemi, 9200lbs vs 9050 in a 2wd long bed regular cab configuration with 3.55 gears. It will out tow the hemi completely if a 3.92 gear set is an option when it goes into production.

Lastly, in your words, "fuel is the only thing". The only thing is a HUGE thing! An eco should beat a hemi with the same configuration by 5mpg, going off the info currently available. Not to mention that the resale of the diesel will be much higher than a hemi truck (based off a trend with 2500&3500 diesel vs. Equal gas models).

Forgive me if I fail to see where you have proved your point.

To the other people in this thread, I realize the diesel won't be for everyone. I've driven hemis. I've owned gas trucks. I've owned diesels. I think the hemi is a fine engine. I just have a problem with someone making ignorant statements about something they haven't driven or even seen yet.
After all that ...it's still going to be a slug. Same tq and 155 less hp you can present it any way you want it still going to be left by the hemi. The tq curve of the hemi is early and flat for a gas motor as well.

You can argue all you want. my argument and opinion will remain unchanged ...you can't sell me on it. It will be a disappointment.
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  #16  
Old 08-13-2013, 03:53 PM
Tshepp Tshepp is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randomid25 View Post

There are already tunes available for the euro engine which uses the same Bosch ecm, so I highly doubt it will take 3 years. http://www.bluesparkautomotive.com/carspecs2?carid=6585 314 max hp/ 527 max tq with just a tuning module out of a 3 liter.

You drive a lifted truck with big tires, wouldn't you like to get better mileage with the life and big tires than the hemi can get?
Wow, those kind of numbers out of a tune would be incredible. It would lag the Hemi with about 80hp but beat it out with 110 tq but I'd like to see how safely that 3.0l can be pushed with mods and tuning. The Eco Diesel will be $3k more than an equally equipped Hemi but after you throw a lift, tune, and big tires on an Eco Diesel you probably still beat out the stock Hemi in mpg. Of course it would be foolish for me to buy a Hemi or Eco Diesel simply looking at fuel economy, but I plan to mod it and just seems that the Eco Diesel might be a better option to handle bigger tires and lift...
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  #17  
Old 08-13-2013, 06:54 PM
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I guess to get an idea of how fast it might be, we should look at the Cherokee with 3.0 and 3.42 rear (?). The Jeep weighs less but not that much less and did 7.7 seconds 0 to 60 and 16 seconds in the quarter. Not the quickest skateboard out there but not that slow either.

I was reading a thread over on the Ford forum about the EB vs EcoD. Don't know how accurate but some one posted this estimate with the 8 speed gearing and 3.55 rear

@ 1500rpm the diesel probably has more HP than the Eco
@ 2000rpm both would be the same
@ 2500rpm both would be the same
@ 3000rpm both would be the same

How much this equates to speed I do not know, but that is not the intent of the EcoD.

Last edited by Ramzaq; 08-13-2013 at 07:38 PM.
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  #18  
Old 08-13-2013, 08:55 PM
exilepa exilepa is offline
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Personally I'd go with the Hemi, but to each their own I guess.
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  #19  
Old 08-13-2013, 09:38 PM
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To the OP: I'd just as soon order. The 8 speeds can be pretty hard to find especially with all the options you want.
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  #20  
Old 08-14-2013, 01:13 AM
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randomid25 randomid25 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crabjoe View Post
What are you talking about?

I agree with you completely!!
I hear ya. My last post was directed at mexi
Quote:
Originally Posted by mexi View Post
After all that ...it's still going to be a slug. Same tq and 155 less hp you can present it any way you want it still going to be left by the hemi. The tq curve of the hemi is early and flat for a gas motor as well.

You can argue all you want. my argument and opinion will remain unchanged ...you can't sell me on it. It will be a disappointment.
I'm not trying to sell you on it. I know plenty of guys like you and you'll never change your mind. Just giving everyone else an opposing opinion based on what info I can find on this engine at the moment instead of just saying this thing will suck or it will the the best thing since sliced bread with no reasoning behind it. I'll be ordering one. If I don't like it when it comes in, I may wind up with a hemi. I've driven 8sp hemi trucks already and they are very nice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tshepp View Post
Wow, those kind of numbers out of a tune would be incredible. It would lag the Hemi with about 80hp but beat it out with 110 tq but I'd like to see how safely that 3.0l can be pushed with mods and tuning. The Eco Diesel will be $3k more than an equally equipped Hemi but after you throw a lift, tune, and big tires on an Eco Diesel you probably still beat out the stock Hemi in mpg. Of course it would be foolish for me to buy a Hemi or Eco Diesel simply looking at fuel economy, but I plan to mod it and just seems that the Eco Diesel might be a better option to handle bigger tires and lift...
Like I said, I'm not sure how long it will take for tunes to come around, but since it uses the same ecm as the euro version and there are tunes available for it right now, I don't think it will take all that long. In the diesel power write up they did on the 3.0, Gale Banks seems to think it has the potential of 500-600 hp. I doubt that is on stock internals, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramzaq View Post
I guess to get an idea of how fast it might be, we should look at the Cherokee with 3.0 and 3.42 rear (?). The Jeep weighs less but not that much less and did 7.7 seconds 0 to 60 and 16 seconds in the quarter. Not the quickest skateboard out there but not that slow either.
I was looking at this, too. Not too bad in a fairly large suv.

P.S. To mexi, the ecodiesel has MORE torque than the hemi in stock form. Not the same torque as you've said twice now.

Last edited by randomid25; 08-14-2013 at 01:42 AM.
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