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  #11  
Old 03-24-2012, 03:05 PM
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The problem is/was that beeker was using a canned tune with a modded engine. Canned tunes are basic and really designed for a minimal amount of mods like my truck,and even so, it would probably take some dyno time with data logging to tweak the tune for max economy/ power.
I don't know all the ins and outs of various 2nd gen trucks, but I do know there's a night and difference between my '97 and my 2000 performance wise, even without a lift on the later. My 97 had 265 tires with 3:21 gears...about like 285s and 3:55s. Yet it would smoke the tires from a dead stop and pull a trailer without strain.
I agree with you on one thing...there are never any real claims of hp, torque, or mileage with tuners. I find it hard to believe that vaiences in factory PCMs would not allow any consistent claim. So I'm hoping to expose the truth on the mileage end.
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Old 03-24-2012, 05:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okiespaniels View Post
The problem is/was that beeker was using a canned tune with a modded engine. Canned tunes are basic and really designed for a minimal amount of mods like my truck,and even so, it would probably take some dyno time with data logging to tweak the tune for max economy/ power.
I don't know all the ins and outs of various 2nd gen trucks, but I do know there's a night and difference between my '97 and my 2000 performance wise, even without a lift on the later. My 97 had 265 tires with 3:21 gears...about like 285s and 3:55s. Yet it would smoke the tires from a dead stop and pull a trailer without strain.
I agree with you on one thing...there are never any real claims of hp, torque, or mileage with tuners. I find it hard to believe that vaiences in factory PCMs would not allow any consistent claim. So I'm hoping to expose the truth on the mileage end.
True but the 4hp 20 lbs of gain was after he went back to Sean and had him tweak it for his mods..
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  #13  
Old 03-25-2012, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by augiedoggy View Post
True but the 4hp 20 lbs of gain was after he went back to Sean and had him tweak it for his mods..

Strange...I JUST went and reread beekers thread. I'm not sure where the the original thread started, but in the thread I was reading, a mod comments in the second post after the first one where the dyno runs were posted and states that 20 ftlbs of torque was a nice gain. Perhaps this was tweaked tune, but I gathered from the responces after wards that beeker was using the canned tunes.
The rest of this thread talks about sean redoing the tune and theres even a post where sean admits by email the tunes are generic and that there can be as many as for different factory tunes in a given pcm!

I'm gonna stick with what I know and just report what I data I get.
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  #14  
Old 03-27-2012, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okiespaniels View Post
Strange...I JUST went and reread beekers thread. I'm not sure where the the original thread started, but in the thread I was reading, a mod comments in the second post after the first one where the dyno runs were posted and states that 20 ftlbs of torque was a nice gain. Perhaps this was tweaked tune, but I gathered from the responces after wards that beeker was using the canned tunes.
The rest of this thread talks about sean redoing the tune and theres even a post where sean admits by email the tunes are generic and that there can be as many as for different factory tunes in a given pcm!

I'm gonna stick with what I know and just report what I data I get.
your right those first dyno numbers were with a canned tune.... but at the end of the thread (I believe it was the same thread) He mentions what Sean said about the canned tunes being to generic to do much for many applications and that Sean was tweaking the tune for him.... which so far has produced no results... If I"M remembering things correctly... the torque number is respectable...4hp Ehh...not so much... I'd certianly be spending my $365 for a set of 1.7 RR which gain 14hp on average instead of a custom tune... but if your looking to squeeze every last option...
Sean has mentioned multiple times that he simply cannot do much in the performance dept and have it run well on 87 octane.. Also look at all the mods Beecker has on his truck...you would think the tune would do a lot for him over someone with a stock intake and such right?

here's beekers results BTW
Updated 1/27/2012 Added SCT 93 tune Dyno Results Below
Went to a dyno event at my local turbo shop. This is the first time I've done it, was a little sloppy pressing the pedal to the metal. Think this gives me a good idea of where I'm at. These are 87 octane pulls, I'm gonna do some 93 octane pulls next week. You can see on both tunes at WOT I'm running very rich. Could be that I wasn't up to full temp yet, they didn't want it too hot while they thread in the A/F sensor. Oh well, still a good picture of what I got. Looking a little light on HP/Tq, I'm sure the 93 tune will show a little better improvment. I think this shop can tune the air/fuel/timing better for me if there's a way to unlock my SCT. I'm gonna call Sean at Hemifever and see if that's possible, that way I can play around with it locally instead of having to order tunes through the net and then re-dyno.
I did 4 pulls, each tune in 2nd and 3rd gear, he didn't print them cause they were kinda sloppy but the 2nd and 3rd gear pulls were very close to being the same.





This is the 93 tune results, the previous was 87 tune
SCT 93 Tune Results - Gained only 3hp and lost 7lb/ft of torque compared to the SCT 87 tune. Running more rich than before even after Hemifever leaned out the tune for me. I was expecting a little more improvement. I ran two pulls with same results. This baffles me because the truck feels stronger on the 93 tune. I'm going to overlay the graphs together when I get them from the shop, then I'll be able to see what rpm range improved and decreased. Also going to get the tune leaned out more from Hemifever. Unfortunately I forgot to bring my SCT programmer with me so I could not get a with tune/without tune comparison. I'm gonna lean out and run again next week so I'll get it then.

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Last edited by augiedoggy; 03-27-2012 at 10:37 AM.
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  #15  
Old 03-27-2012, 10:55 PM
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I'm kinda waiting to see if beeker gets what he wants from Sean.

On the other hand, I believe that no performance from an 87 tune is a crock....I shouldn't say that becaue I know very little about tuning computerized engines. Trouble is, they work the same as any engine. Air fuel go in at the right ratio, gets fired at the right moment with a correct amount of spark, and the piston rotates the crank and turns the tires.
I used to "power tune" vehicles regularly at a local speed shop back int the day. This consisted of setting the advance on a Sun Distributor machine, even modding distributors, setting total timing with a gun and balancer tape, and jetting up or down as needed. We used to get a lot of Vans and trucks back in the day and could turn them into good runners with a bit of work. I almost never needed to have to tell a customer he needed premium gas to make them run better, although we coulda probably squeezed a bit more power out of them if we did.
Anyway I tend to look at tuners the same way. Are canned tunes not the way to go? I wish I had data logging so I could "power tune" my truck. I had a '73 Chevy Siverado with a 454 that I used to get 20 mpg with on the hwy.

EDIT: I rereading your copy of beekers post...and I don't get something. On the first dyno graph, the red line (87 tune) reads 189 hp and the torque curve is around 250 ft lbs. The torque curve is longer and flatter than the stock PCM whch is what you want for good acceleration. It also peaks earlier in the rpm curve (you can't go by the speeds, it's an overlay)

The 93 tune shows 199 hp ...about a 10 hp gain over the 87 tune. Where did he lose 3 hp? It also shows 265 ftlbs torque...about another 10 lb over the 87 Octane run>> again where did he lose power?
If beeker had actually overlayed the 87 tune over the stock tune so that engine speed and rpm matched we would see a huge jump in low end torque with a higher peak and taper on the end.
Same thing with hp...the engine practicaly jumps out of itself to peak hp on a longer higher curve.

The 93 tune is even more impressive...if you believe the rpm #s at the bottom.

Last edited by Okiespaniels; 03-27-2012 at 11:16 PM.
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  #16  
Old 03-28-2012, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okiespaniels View Post
I'm kinda waiting to see if beeker gets what he wants from Sean.

On the other hand, I believe that no performance from an 87 tune is a crock....I shouldn't say that becaue I know very little about tuning computerized engines. Trouble is, they work the same as any engine. Air fuel go in at the right ratio, gets fired at the right moment with a correct amount of spark, and the piston rotates the crank and turns the tires.
I used to "power tune" vehicles regularly at a local speed shop back int the day. This consisted of setting the advance on a Sun Distributor machine, even modding distributors, setting total timing with a gun and balancer tape, and jetting up or down as needed. We used to get a lot of Vans and trucks back in the day and could turn them into good runners with a bit of work. I almost never needed to have to tell a customer he needed premium gas to make them run better, although we coulda probably squeezed a bit more power out of them if we did.
Anyway I tend to look at tuners the same way. Are canned tunes not the way to go? I wish I had data logging so I could "power tune" my truck. I had a '73 Chevy Siverado with a 454 that I used to get 20 mpg with on the hwy.

EDIT: I rereading your copy of beekers post...and I don't get something. On the first dyno graph, the red line (87 tune) reads 189 hp and the torque curve is around 250 ft lbs. The torque curve is longer and flatter than the stock PCM whch is what you want for good acceleration. It also peaks earlier in the rpm curve (you can't go by the speeds, it's an overlay)

The 93 tune shows 199 hp ...about a 10 hp gain over the 87 tune. Where did he lose 3 hp? It also shows 265 ftlbs torque...about another 10 lb over the 87 Octane run>> again where did he lose power?
If beeker had actually overlayed the 87 tune over the stock tune so that engine speed and rpm matched we would see a huge jump in low end torque with a higher peak and taper on the end.
Same thing with hp...the engine practicaly jumps out of itself to peak hp on a longer higher curve.

The 93 tune is even more impressive...if you believe the rpm #s at the bottom.
thats just it.... 87 octane severly limits the amount of time advance you can use without pinging...which limits the tuning capabilities for more power I never said you couldnt get any increase.. just that it wont be much form a tune because there is less range of timing adjustments that can be done...
I was also confused by the graphs... I went by what he said....I think his dyno results for the 93 octane were updated after Sean tweaked his tune and he just forgot to edit the text in that file which was from the first run with the first 93 tune
the second set of numbers is respectable for $365 or whatever it is for the tuner and a custom written tune vs a canned one...

Last edited by augiedoggy; 03-28-2012 at 07:35 PM.
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  #17  
Old 03-28-2012, 09:23 PM
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Well...after this tank of gas is done I may load the 93 tune but with some 87 octane gas. I wouldn't be the first guy who's been able to run the 93 tune on 87 octane. If I can't I'll dial down.
I'm thinking the 93 tune posted is the first(canned) one. Note the A/F ratio is very rich. Sean was supposed to lean it up.
I hope beeker reposts what the custom tune does.
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  #18  
Old 04-09-2012, 09:20 PM
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Hello everyone!

I've run through two tanks of gas up till today, recording a 10.2 mpg and another 10.7 mpg.

I have not installed the 93 tune yet, but will do so after this tank(just filled) runs out.
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  #19  
Old 04-12-2012, 09:34 AM
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Have you ruled out other problems such as a leaky plenum gasket? 10.2 miles per gallon isnt all that great for these trucks...
Unless maybe you have larger tires without changing the gearing to match or something?

I have a lift and 35" mud tires with 4.56 gears along with an ext cab and tool box weighing mine down and I still manage an average of 12mpg with a stock tune on a 96 5.9L?
Be careful of pinging with 87 octane and the timing advance of a 93 octane tune it wont be hard to burn a hole right through your piston...

Last edited by augiedoggy; 04-12-2012 at 09:37 AM.
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  #20  
Old 04-12-2012, 07:22 PM
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Plenum was changed eons ago and is fine.
You'd have to have a LOT of Hard pre ignition to burn a hole through a piston. I mean..my truck had a leaky plenum and pinged like crazy...no apparent damage. It probably ran 5 years like that.
If it pings I'll back down....I'm running an 89 tune on 87 gas wihtout a hint of ping.
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