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  #11  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:23 AM
Swaggerville Ram's Avatar
Swaggerville Ram Swaggerville Ram is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edge35 View Post
I'd be very surprised if using 4wd Auto caused any appreciable accelerated wear. Using 4WD lock on any surface that has anything above mediocre traction (including wet pavement) is likely to do much more damage.
Any proof to back this opinion?
I see this nonsense on here all the time, if someone puts 2 or 5 miles on dry pavement in 4 wheel drive you'll blow your tcase
Complete hogwash.
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Last edited by Swaggerville Ram; 11-25-2013 at 08:26 AM.
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  #12  
Old 11-25-2013, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swaggerville Ram View Post
Any proof to back this opinion?
What part are you referring to? If you mean the part where I said I'd be surprised if it hurt then no, other than the fact that common sense would dictate that since Chrysler has been putting 4wd Auto mode in various vehicles for years it would stand to reason that using it either doesn't harm the vehicle, they'd warn owners to use is sparingly, or they would discontinue it altogether to avoid constant warranty claims and a bad reputation (especially the Jeep brand where constant 4wd issues would look particularly bad).

If you are referring to using 4wd lock on surfaces with traction that don't allow for wheel slippage I don't think that requires any proof (and the fact is that it would be much more time consuming finding any reputable piece of information that says it is ok to use it on dry pavement). Sure, you can do it for short distances at a time and likely get away with it but 1) why would you even bother doing it and 2) why would you do something that the engineers who built the car say not to?
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Last edited by edge35; 11-25-2013 at 08:38 AM.
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  #13  
Old 11-25-2013, 09:19 AM
Monster5601 Monster5601 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swaggerville Ram View Post
I personally do not like the auto option. I know quite a few GM guys that had to rebuild tcases because of this. I don't know if the ram setup is better or not but I'd be willing to bet it is similar. Too easy for it to engage under hard acceleration, it will only do that so many times till it breaks
Hog-wash! Don't tell this to my 2003 Tahoe with 199,000 miles or my 2008 Tahoe with 138,000 miles. Folks that had to rebuild there GM transfer cases (Autotrac) did it because either they ignored routine maintenance or (2002 -2007) they failed to fix the oil-pump issue which was a well published design flaw. The issue were not related to Autotrack.

The computer determines when four wheel is engaged. What makes you think the computer would allow engagement under hard acceleration?
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  #14  
Old 11-25-2013, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edge35 View Post
I'd be very surprised if using 4wd Auto caused any appreciable accelerated wear. Using 4WD lock on any surface that has anything above mediocre traction (including wet pavement) is likely to do much more damage.
Agree


Quote:
Originally Posted by Swaggerville Ram View Post
Any proof to back this opinion?
I see this nonsense on here all the time, if someone puts 2 or 5 miles on dry pavement in 4 wheel drive you'll blow your tcase
Complete hogwash.
4WD auto and 4WD Lock are 2 different monsters. Take your SLT and put it in 4WD Lock, then driver your truck in circles on dry pavement you will see what it does,, try and back up with your truck while turning in 4WD lock you will hear and feel what it does to your tcase, do it often enough you will kill your Transfer case.


From the manual:

From the Manual

4WD AUTO mode, the front axle is engaged, but
the vehicle’s power is sent to the rear wheels. Four-wheel
drive will be automatically engaged when the vehicle
senses a loss of traction. Because the front axle is engaged,
this mode will result in lower fuel economy than
the 2WD mode. When additional traction is required, the transfer case

4WD LOCK and 4WD LOW positions can be used to lock
the front and rear drive shafts together forcing the front
and rear wheels to rotate at the same speed. The 4WD LOCK and 4WD
LOW positions are designed for loose, slippery road
surfaces only. Driving in the 4WD LOCK and 4WD LOW
positions on dry hard surfaced roads may cause increased
tire wear and damage to the drive line components.
4wd Auto can be run on any surface at any speed.


For variable driving conditions, the 4WD AUTO mode
can be used. In this mode, the front axle is engaged, but
the vehicle’s power is sent to the rear wheels. Four-wheel
drive will be automatically engaged when the vehicle
senses a loss of traction. Because the front axle is engaged,
this mode will result in lower fuel economy than
the 2WD mode. When additional traction is required, the transfer case

4WD LOCK and 4WD LOW positions can be used to lock
the front and rear driveshafts together forcing the front
and rear wheels to rotate at the same speed. This is
accomplished by rotating the 4WD Control Switch to the
desired position. Refer to “Shifting Procedure” for specific
shifting instructions. The 4WD LOCK and 4WD
LOW positions are designed for loose, slippery road
surfaces only. Driving in the 4WD LOCK and 4WD LOW
positions on dry hard surfaced roads may cause increased
tire wear and damage to the driveline components.
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  #15  
Old 11-25-2013, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swaggerville Ram View Post
I personally do not like the auto option. I know quite a few GM guys that had to rebuild tcases because of this. I don't know if the ram setup is better or not but I'd be willing to bet it is similar. Too easy for it to engage under hard acceleration, it will only do that so many times till it breaks
I would say that if Ford could build my Control Trac 4 wheel drive transfer case in 1997 with the only modes available being 4 Auto, 4 High and 4 Low and allow me to get nearly 160,000 miles on it with never a problem, that Ram could design a transfer case 16 years later that works just as well.
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  #16  
Old 11-25-2013, 04:36 PM
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Not to beat a dead horse here either, but think of every "cute ute" out there now as well. Most nowadays don't even allow for 4-lock option and are all auto. Only difference is they run FWD most often and kick in the rear when slippage is detected.
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  #17  
Old 11-26-2013, 02:15 PM
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There was a flap over this awhile back too. Been driving off road 4 wheel vehicles for decades and every users manual has had a clear warning against driving with locked fronts on dry pavement in a part time system like these dodges have. Plenty of info out there on the web on why this creates additional wear and tear, not worth arguing with the newbies on it IMO.

Regarding the systems that have the front axle spinning but not engaged, I've always been curious what a good auto engineer and an experienced long time part time 4 wheel mechanic would say.

My simplistic view is that you are turning parts in auto that aren't turning when not in auto. Has to be some eventual wear involved there even in the best of systems.

My personal experience has me avoiding it under most circumstances, as I think the worst chance of wear or breakage is not when the front isn't engaged, but WHEN IT DOES ENGAGE. If you have even been in a part time computer engaged system that kicks in when one end or the other starts fishtailing, you'll feel it and know what I mean. You are engaging gearing under stress IMO. I don't see how that can't lead to accelerated wear and even occasionally cause a problem right away.

If you need it to avoid sliding off the road or getting into an accident however, that concern is probably moot. If I am traveling down a highway with variable slippery conditions and I want or need to do that at highway speeds, I'll use auto. Otherwise if conditions warrant it, I slow down and go full lock, the safest way to handle it. I will also use full lock on lousy off road trails where the suspension gets a workout. It smooths out the ride quite a bit and keeps you out of a problem better than auto if there's a hole deeper than it appears, or one that sends that end of the truck straight down into muck.
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  #18  
Old 11-26-2013, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monster5601 View Post
The computer determines when four wheel is engaged. What makes you think the computer would allow engagement under hard acceleration?
Show us where the dodge system detects the truck is slipping under acceleration--but does NOT lock in 4 wheel when under acceleration--and you might have a point.

I don't think you can however. I believe the system engages when it detects slippage--and does not consider whether acceleration is occuring at the time or not.

During our first snow last week I came around a corner in auto and goosed it a bit to see what would happen. Just a bit mind you. I can say the auto system on my truck kicked in when the back was sliding away from the direction of the turn, and it was quite a jolt when it did.
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  #19  
Old 11-26-2013, 05:03 PM
Monster5601 Monster5601 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawoodsman View Post
Show us where the dodge system detects the truck is slipping under acceleration--but does NOT lock in 4 wheel when under acceleration--and you might have a point.

I don't think you can however. I believe the system engages when it detects slippage--and does not consider whether acceleration is occuring at the time or not.

During our first snow last week I came around a corner in auto and goosed it a bit to see what would happen. Just a bit mind you. I can say the auto system on my truck kicked in when the back was sliding away from the direction of the turn, and it was quite a jolt when it did.
You may very well be correct, I don't have the inside information on Chrysler systems, but my kid does, I'll ask him. I can tell you how GM and Ford systems engage since I've directly worked with those systems.

But, in the context of this discussion, the issue was over spinning the tires and not slippage, there is a difference.
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  #20  
Old 11-27-2013, 02:08 AM
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While you are asking your kid, could you ask him if he knows if the Rams 4x4 Auto system is proportional? On my Explorer the Control Trac transfer case could divert up to 90% of the torque to either the front or rear axle in steps. It was very smooth to engage the fronts when the rear started slipping. From the sounds of the Ram's system it is either engaged or not engaged so when the rear slips it quickly goes into 4x4 Lock until the front and rear axles turn at the same speed then it releases the front. That would seem to be a harsher way of engaging things and could result in a jolt when it does. I've only had mine in Auto once and that was in the rain. I didn't really get on the throttle too hard though so it didn't feel any different than 2WD mode.
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