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  #1  
Old 01-04-2010, 01:20 AM
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Default Ram won't start after sitting a few days...

OK, I've had my 09' Ram Sport for a little over 3 months now (4347 miles). It's ran great and been a wonderful daily driver... If I drive it at least once every few days.
If I let it sit more than about 4 days its totally dead when I try to start it. I can't even get into the darn thing without using the cut key since the key FOB doesn't work either. Complete power failure/drained battery.

This has happened twice now since I bought it in late September.
I've gone out of town and came home (once for 4 days and this past week for 6 days) and its totally dead. I have to jump it with the wifes Lexus and she'll fire back up and run fine. The first time it happened I talked to the dealer and ran it by so they could check it out. Both the battery and the charging system checked out fine. I haven't done anything to the electrical system and nothing has been left powered on to cause the power drain so I'm stumped.

Anyone have any ideas or experienced this issue with the 09' Ram?
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:39 AM
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After the battery is discharged, it needs to be brought back to a full charge with a trickle charger. Chrysler charging systems are not designed to charge in the traditional sense; they're designed to keep up with the what's being used by the systems that are running. You could jump start the truck and drive it for 6 hours with everything turned off and you'll have nothing more than a surface charge on the battery.
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Old 01-04-2010, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Remerson228 View Post
After the battery is discharged, it needs to be brought back to a full charge with a trickle charger. Chrysler charging systems are not designed to charge in the traditional sense; they're designed to keep up with the what's being used by the systems that are running. You could jump start the truck and drive it for 6 hours with everything turned off and you'll have nothing more than a surface charge on the battery.
I wonder if they checked the battery with a load on it. You can have a battery show good voltage just sitting there and then watch it fall through the floor once it sees a load if it has a weak/bad cell. That coupled with the charging system info per Remerson above might explain why the problem persists.
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Old 01-04-2010, 12:28 PM
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Go to autozone and have them do it.
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Old 01-04-2010, 01:13 PM
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Mine did the same exact thing once so far, I have had it about 3 months now. I let it sit four days and tried to unlock it and the key fob was dead tried to start it and then it wouldnt let my key be removed. I jumped it with my wifes car and it started. put a battery charger on it but it showed full charge right after hooking it up. I took it to the deaership the next morning (started fine) they pulled a load on the system and did a full electrical system check and nothing came back wrong. Hasnt done it again but then again it hasnt sat for a period of more than a day or two.

2009 2wd sport cc 5.7
3k miles

btw they said next time just call the tow service and bring it in at that state. but after hearing your same problem dodge has to know about other trucks doing this and they dont have a clue.

Last edited by Slowburn; 01-04-2010 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 01-04-2010, 01:27 PM
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It's not a problem with the trucks or the charging systems. 99.9% of the time the problem is the owner/driver who will leave accessories on without the engine running and deplete the battery. Post #2 in this thread explains why this is a bad idea. Also, ALL vehicles made since about 1980 have a slight key off draw on the battery to keep the memory alive in the PCM/ECM (typically under 100ma). Even the best battery made will eventually lose its charge from keep alive memory. If you plan to be awa from the vehicle for more than a week or so, pulling the IOD (ignition off draw) fuse will greatly slow the discharge rate. I'd bet a weeks pay that if I could pull 20 trucks off this forum and put a volt meter on their batteries, not more than one or two of them would read 12.65V (full charge).
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Old 01-04-2010, 02:15 PM
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This is really good stuff right here! I'm learning so much from you guys
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:16 PM
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Remmerson if what you are saying is correct then you should be able to walk out to any truck on your lot, especially the ones that have been on the lot the longest, and it would have a lower voltage then what is on a truck that just came off of the transport truck, if not have trouble with unlocking the doors or starting.
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:20 PM
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Right, and that's the case. Typically if I have to bring one in off the lot for an RRT and I hook the scan tool to it, the voltages hover around 11.8-12.2. There are instances where a jump start is necessary because the IOD fuses arent pulled while they're sitting on the lot like Chrysler says to.
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnyard View Post
I wonder if they checked the battery with a load on it. You can have a battery show good voltage just sitting there and then watch it fall through the floor once it sees a load if it has a weak/bad cell. That coupled with the charging system info per Remerson above might explain why the problem persists.
Yeah, the first time it happened (late October) the truck hadn't been driven in 4 days. I jumped it with the wifes car. Packed up the cables and drove it straight to the dealership about 10 minutes away. They weren't too busy so they had a mechanic go outside with a cart full of testing equipment. I watched him do the voltage checks with the truck running and not running, battery load tests, and charging system tests and all were within spec. It never did it again until it sat in the driveway for 6 days while we were in Wisconsin on vacation after Christmas.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Slowburn View Post
Mine did the same exact thing once so far, I have had it about 3 months now. I let it sit four days and tried to unlock it and the key fob was dead tried to start it and then it wouldnt let my key be removed. I jumped it with my wifes car and it started. put a battery charger on it but it showed full charge right after hooking it up. I took it to the deaership the next morning (started fine) they pulled a load on the system and did a full electrical system check and nothing came back wrong. Hasnt done it again but then again it hasnt sat for a period of more than a day or two.

2009 2wd sport cc 5.7
3k miles

btw they said next time just call the tow service and bring it in at that state. but after hearing your same problem dodge has to know about other trucks doing this and they dont have a clue.
Well I'm glad to here that someone else has experienced this same issue. You did everything almost exactly as I did except I took it to the dealer right away. It's weird how the key can't be removed when the vehicle is dead. I didn't insert the key the second time it happened until I hooked up the jumper cables. The dealership was clueless and couldn't explain why the key can't be removed when the truck was dead either. My truck usually doesn't sit more than a day or two as well without any problems. Even 3 days and its fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remerson228 View Post
After the battery is discharged, it needs to be brought back to a full charge with a trickle charger. Chrysler charging systems are not designed to charge in the traditional sense; they're designed to keep up with the what's being used by the systems that are running. You could jump start the truck and drive it for 6 hours with everything turned off and you'll have nothing more than a surface charge on the battery.
A surface charge will easily be removed from any battery by turning on the headlights for 15-20 seconds and letting the battery sit for a 4-5 minutes to stabilize. The load test on a battery tester also achieves that. Not sure that I would agree that a Denso 160 amp generator isn't enough to keep up with powering the trucks systems that are running as well as charging the battery???

The 2009 Ram Factory Service Manual explains that the EVR increases battery charging voltage when the sensed voltage falls to 0.5 volts or lower .

REGULATOR, Voltage
The amount of direct current produced by the generator is controlled by EVR circuitry contained within the PCM. This circuitry is connected in series with the generators second rotor field terminal and its ground.

Voltage is regulated by cycling the battery positive path to control the strength of the rotor magnetic field. The EVR circuitry monitors system line voltage (B+) and battery temperature (refer to Battery Temperature Sensor for more information). It then determines a target charging voltage. If sensed battery voltage is 0.5 volts or lower than the target voltage, the PCM grounds the field winding until sensed battery voltage is 0.5 volts above target voltage. A circuit in the PCM cycles the battery positive (high side) of the generator field up to 400 times per second (400Hz), but has the capability to ground the field control wire 100% of the time (full field) to achieve the target voltage. If the charging rate cannot be monitored (limp-in), a duty cycle of 25% is used by the PCM in order to have some generator output (Refer to 08 - Electrical/8F - Engine Systems/Charging - Operation) for additional information.


Not sure if any of this is related.....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Remerson228 View Post
It's not a problem with the trucks or the charging systems. 99.9% of the time the problem is the owner/driver who will leave accessories on without the engine running and deplete the battery. Post #2 in this thread explains why this is a bad idea. Also, ALL vehicles made since about 1980 have a slight key off draw on the battery to keep the memory alive in the PCM/ECM (typically under 100ma). Even the best battery made will eventually lose its charge from keep alive memory. If you plan to be awa from the vehicle for more than a week or so, pulling the IOD (ignition off draw) fuse will greatly slow the discharge rate. I'd bet a weeks pay that if I could pull 20 trucks off this forum and put a volt meter on their batteries, not more than one or two of them would read 12.65V (full charge).
OK, as explained earlier. There wasn't/isn't any accessories that were plugged into or left powered on while the truck was parked either time this has happened. The Factory Service Manual says that the IOD Ignition Off Draw for the Ram is somewhere between 5 and 35 milliamperes. Thats pretty low. It also recommends pulling the IOD fuse only if the vehicle is going to sit for 20 days or more. I don't even come close to letting the truck sit that long. 4-5 days shouldn't be an issue. All the system are designed to be in "sleep mode" within 10 minutes of the truck being turned off. Sounds like something isn't going to sleep properly.

Looks like I'm going to the dealer for IOD tests on Thursday.
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Last edited by Airdog; 01-04-2010 at 03:27 PM.
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