DODGE RAM FORUM - Ram Forums and Owners Club! - Dodge Truck Forum

Go Back   DODGE RAM FORUM - Ram Forums and Owners Club! - Dodge Truck Forum > Dodge Ram Forum - Mod Zone - Custom Dodge Ram Mods - Dodge Ram Performance > Custom Dodge Ram Performance Mods - Engine - 4.7 Liter V8


Notices

Custom Dodge Ram Performance Mods - Engine - 4.7 Liter V8 Discuss modifying your Dodge Ram with Performance Parts and Accessories!
Factory Spec: 4.7-liter V8 engine - 310 horsepower, 330 lb-ft of torque.


Latest Vendor News
AutoAnything
Addictive Desert Designs!
Bayou Goat Mounts

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #71  
Old 01-30-2012, 08:46 AM
snrusnak's Avatar
snrusnak snrusnak is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Orlando
Age: 27
Posts: 13,377
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2010 Dodge Ram 1500
Trim Level: SLT
Color: White
Engine: 2008-20?? 287ci (4.7L) PowerTech V8 310hp 330lb/ft
Rep Power: 12
Rep:1385
snrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud of
Default

The proper thing to do would be pull the valve covers, check each valve stem to rocker arm clearance with a feeler gauge, and adjust them all (if needed) to the appropriate clearance (by shimming the lash adjusters). I'm not sure what the appropriate clearance is, but I'm sure it can be found. Again, member superiorstyles has a lot of information regarding this.

EDIT: The reason I say check/adjust them all is because he said before that he did not initially check/adjust any of them. It is something that should be done and since he didn't do it then it should be done now. Some may not need adjusting but they need checked to be sure.
__________________
Sean

Breathing in and out is good enough for me.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #72  
Old 01-30-2012, 09:22 AM
RadioFlyer's Avatar
RadioFlyer RadioFlyer is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 945
Gender: Male
Rep Power: 6
Rep:146
RadioFlyer will become famous soon enoughRadioFlyer will become famous soon enough
Default

Lol, I understand your point but the proper clearence is 0 lash. No offense but i t doesn't take a rocket scientist or a feeler gauge to find 0 lash, lol. The easiest way would be to leave the covers on and find the culprit with a makeshift stethoscope while the engine is running. He can search for his vacumm leak at the same time. If all else fails then he can go back and inspect them all. He can use the feeler gauge when he finds the culprit.
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 01-30-2012, 09:42 AM
snrusnak's Avatar
snrusnak snrusnak is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Orlando
Age: 27
Posts: 13,377
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2010 Dodge Ram 1500
Trim Level: SLT
Color: White
Engine: 2008-20?? 287ci (4.7L) PowerTech V8 310hp 330lb/ft
Rep Power: 12
Rep:1385
snrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud of
Default

Zero valve lash is not correct, especially with hydraulic valve trains. Normally if you adjust the lash this way you get valves that don't fully close. It's possible to get close to the appropriate clearance without a feeler gauge, you can adjust it until the push rod(or in this case valve lash adjuster) is just barely able to wiggle by hand(and I really mean just barely), but why would you do this when you can do it the right way and have accurate lash set with a $0.99 feeler gauge, not to mention it doesn't take any more time. There's nothing wrong with identifying which one is tapping, but personally I would want all the valves to have the proper clearance. I don't think chrysler checks and adjusts this from the factory, as about every engine has the same noise. I believe they feel that the hydraulic adjusters will make up for the loose clearance, which they do, eventually. He could probably leave them and it'd be fine, but it seems like he wants to get it perfect, so the best thing to do is to get proper lash on every valve. There's no point in doing one or a couple when the others may be out as well. There may not even be a published lash from chrysler, but typically for a hydraulic valve train you want about 0.030", adjusted using the correct method, I assume the valve lash adjusters are basically the same design as a lifter...Many people make mistakes when adjusting hydraulic lifters because they bleed down.
__________________
Sean

Breathing in and out is good enough for me.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 01-30-2012, 10:45 AM
RadioFlyer's Avatar
RadioFlyer RadioFlyer is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 945
Gender: Male
Rep Power: 6
Rep:146
RadioFlyer will become famous soon enoughRadioFlyer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by snrusnak View Post
Zero valve lash is not correct, especially[CODE][/CODE] with hydraulic valve trains. Normally if you adjust the lash this way you get valves that don't fully close. There may not even be a published lash from chrysler, but typically for a hydraulic valve train you want about 0.030", adjusted using the correct method, I assume the valve lash adjusters are basically the same design as a lifter...Many people make mistakes when adjusting hydraulic lifters because they bleed down.
Lol...no pun intended, but it's evident that you don't have any experience adjusting valves. Hydraulic cams call for 0 lash and 0 clearence...not .030 so to save arguement I think it's best for me to but out of this topic...good luck IN2H20.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 01-30-2012, 10:59 AM
snrusnak's Avatar
snrusnak snrusnak is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Orlando
Age: 27
Posts: 13,377
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2010 Dodge Ram 1500
Trim Level: SLT
Color: White
Engine: 2008-20?? 287ci (4.7L) PowerTech V8 310hp 330lb/ft
Rep Power: 12
Rep:1385
snrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud of
Default

0.030" of lifter preload. Most hydraulic lifters have about 0.060" of plunger movement, and you want it preloaded to about half of that, so 0.030". If you have the preload too loose or too tight the valves will either not fully close or the rockers will be loose causing tapping. I'm not positive if the OHC lash adjusters have the same range of movement, that's why I said it would be best to find a publishing from chrysler, or test the range of the plunger before install, or some other method to figure out the range. While on the engine you should be able to use a feeler gauge to find the range and then you can get the middle point. My whole point is that it should not be done by guessing, it'd run but not as good as it should and it could cause premature lifter failure.

EDIT: IN2H2O, I think superiorstyles would have an answer for you, and he always seems happy to help out. I'm applying what I know of lifters to the lash adjusters assuming they operate the same, but he has actually built these engines so has more experience than I do. He is the one who told me how you make the adjustments by shimming and not by adjusting the rocker arm (that was news to me).
__________________
Sean

Breathing in and out is good enough for me.

Last edited by snrusnak; 01-30-2012 at 11:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 01-30-2012, 03:00 PM
RadioFlyer's Avatar
RadioFlyer RadioFlyer is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 945
Gender: Male
Rep Power: 6
Rep:146
RadioFlyer will become famous soon enoughRadioFlyer will become famous soon enough
Default

First of all you are contradicting yourself, lol. You said that my 0 valve lash adjustment was wrong and the correct lash was .030, you never mentioned anything about preload. Second, preload has nothing to do with valve lash in this case. Preload is the distance that the pushrod submerges into the lifter. It has nothing to do with the distance the plunger travels in the lifter. Third, adding shims to the bottom of the adjuster is to help correct the geometry that may have been altered by switching what ever valvetrain parts from one engine to another (if he did). Lol, and last...I am happy to help as well but I can't say that about you constantly insulting my inteligence when ever I chime in to do so. I hope this freind of yours schools you somewhat about lash and preload when he chimes in because the info you got from the internet doesn't apply in this case and I'll let him tell you why, lol.
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 01-30-2012, 03:29 PM
snrusnak's Avatar
snrusnak snrusnak is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Orlando
Age: 27
Posts: 13,377
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2010 Dodge Ram 1500
Trim Level: SLT
Color: White
Engine: 2008-20?? 287ci (4.7L) PowerTech V8 310hp 330lb/ft
Rep Power: 12
Rep:1385
snrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud of
Default

Hey RF I'm not trying to insult your intelligence. It seems like any thread we post in together this happens; some people just can't get along huh?

I have never done this on the 4.7L, but I believe it to be the same application as "normal" hydraulic lifters. Wouldn't you agree that the proper amount of lifter preload is important, rather than just guessing at it by putting shims under a noisy lifter? If you do just guess at it then you don't know how much to shim it, unless you check the clearance at the valve. Zero lash should only be achieved once the lifters are filled with oil; when they are not filled with oil the lash should not be adjusted to zero or the valves will not close all the way once they do fill with oil. This is the way I understand it, and how I've applied it in the engine's I've put together(I learned the first time I put an engine together that the lash should not be zero because when you try to fire up the engine and the valves aren't closing you don't get compression and it doesn't start...I then figured out after days of head scratching and with help from a friend that I had adjusted them wrong).
__________________
Sean

Breathing in and out is good enough for me.
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 01-30-2012, 03:47 PM
GTyankee's Avatar
GTyankee GTyankee is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Member

 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: San Diego East County, Ca
Posts: 18,220
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2009 Dodge Ram 1500 2X4
Trim Level: quad cab SLT
Color: sunburst orange pearl
Rep Power: 19
Rep:2608
GTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond reputeGTyankee has a reputation beyond repute
Default

It all goes out the window IF you have a collapsed lifter

which is not too unusual in high mileage engines
__________________
Ram 1500 SLT Quad cab, 5.7 HEMI(R) MDS VCT, 5 speed auto 545RFE, 3.55 differential gears, 18" Magnaflow muffler, EGR bug deflector, Bushwacker fender flares, customized Nfab nerf bars, CB radio, Autonet wi-fi router, custom soft tonneau cover, Line_X bedliner, DEBO Step, build date 10/15/08 a Wednesday built vehicle
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 01-30-2012, 07:24 PM
RadioFlyer's Avatar
RadioFlyer RadioFlyer is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: May 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 945
Gender: Male
Rep Power: 6
Rep:146
RadioFlyer will become famous soon enoughRadioFlyer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTyankee View Post
It all goes out the window IF you have a collapsed lifter

which is not too unusual in high mileage engines
Very true...here's a little something of interest. Not the same problem but similar so "listen well you must" young Skywalker (snrusnak), lol!
Reply With Quote
  #80  
Old 01-30-2012, 08:56 PM
snrusnak's Avatar
snrusnak snrusnak is offline
Dodge Ram Forum Senior Member!
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Orlando
Age: 27
Posts: 13,377
Gender: Male
Vehicle: 2010 Dodge Ram 1500
Trim Level: SLT
Color: White
Engine: 2008-20?? 287ci (4.7L) PowerTech V8 310hp 330lb/ft
Rep Power: 12
Rep:1385
snrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud ofsnrusnak has much to be proud of
Default

GT, he had said that he changed all the lifters to try and fix the problem, and no doubt it is possible to get faulty new parts, but it seems unlikely.

RF, you speak for yourself. What you posted is video of the text that I posted: too loose of a lash (and preload) will allow the tapping and in his case in the video, the rocker to pop off when the lifter bleeds down. His fix was to measure and find the range of the plunger in the lifter, then used a shim to adjust the preload to about half of the range, which is about the right preload. Notice he also checked compression on the cylinder to ensure that preload was not too much (valves not closing all the way). And it does actually appear to be the same problem.

This is exactly what I think should be done in IN2H2O's case, but I think he should check them all, to be sure they are all ok.
__________________
Sean

Breathing in and out is good enough for me.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Advertisement






All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:39 PM.


= Copyright RamForumZ.com a Gigathreads.com Network Site =Ad Management by RedTyger
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vB.Sponsors


=Gigathreads Network=
CLUBS MOPAR NATION DSM GPMM MAMM JAM
DIESEL Diesel Forum      
CHEVY Chevy Camaro Forum Chevy Volt Forum    
CHRYSLER Chrysler 300C Forum      
DODGE Dodge Avenger Forum Dodge Caliber Forum Dodge Challenger Forum Dodge Charger Forum
  Dodge Circuit Forum Dodge Hornet Forum Dodge Magnum Forum Dodge Nitro Forum
  Dodge Ram Forum Dodge Dakota Forum Dodge Durango Forum Dodge Dart Forum
FORD Ford Raptor Forum Ford F150 Forum Ford F100 Forum  
JEEP Jeep Forum      
PONTIAC Pontiac G8 Forum      
SRT SRT Viper Forum SRT Cuda Forum