[alnmarg]

Just a question guys - has anyone used a ohm meter to see if there is any resistance between TB and true grnd? If you get a reading less then this wire makes sense. but it could be that true Grnd varies during driving. In other words your engine grnd is not connected properly. The circuit does have a few connections and a leak is possible.

 

[nocashnosplash]

Before installing the ground wire,with the ohm meter the casing of the tb wasnt ground at all.So maybe the TB is grounded inside only. Well the ground wire didnt affect anything and it seem to improve the engine response; placebo effect maybe!!!
Anyway its a keeper.

 

[AKRAM]

I'm also curious if there are other electrical components that are isolated from a good ground, that might cause performance issues. Any thoughts?

 

[electriccity]

Well after reading this thread...I gotta try it...shoot its a wire why not. Ill admit the more grounds on a computer controlled system the beter. The computer does a lot with ground so a sturdy ground set up cant hurt. Ive had several older mitsu galants in my shop that we had to repair grounds on that was causing ignition coils to burn up.

 

[P-Rez]

Ground all the parts!!!

 

[GTyankee]

On my last truck, there were 11 or more grounds, all installed at the factory
body to frame, engine to frame, cab to bed, bed to frame, starter to frame & engine was the connection that went bad twice.
I started using the old style Ground Strap, flat Braided, 4 Gauge, Tin Coated Copper, with heavy-duty eyelets. Factory only uses a single wire.
Poor engine grounds are the leading cause of ignition problems.

 

[MartinJD]

I just did a few test drives w/out the ground and plan on throwin it on tomorrow and doing another drive to try it for myself. There is a noticable delay in throttle response stock, however, I am still skeptical. Since I can't tune my 2011 I'm looking for anything I can do to improve performance. We'll see tomorrow!

 

[NWRQC]

Here is the 10 awg ground wire I made from thick shielded wire (stereo shop) and some simple insulated connectors! I spent 15 bucks on wire to make two, but the wire will last forever!

Now add some heat shrink to keep the water/moisture sealed out so it will last.

Before installing the ground wire,with the ohm meter the casing of the tb wasnt ground at all.So maybe the TB is grounded inside only. Well the ground wire didnt affect anything and it seem to improve the engine response; placebo effect maybe!!!
Anyway its a keeper.

I believe the ground is on the connector, but the housing should serve as a ground. So You had no continuity between the tb and ground prior to doing this mod, and after grounding the tb you still had no continuity? What are you using as the ground source? logic tells me that if you ground the housing (body of the tb) you shall see continuity between it and and a solid ground.

 

[nocashnosplash]

Yes indeed, I was getting full continuity as a solid ground on the TB after installing the ground wire . Sorry for my bad english!

 

[NWRQC]

Gotcha. No prob.
So you got no continuity before installing the ground wire, and good ground afterwards? I wonder if the factory ground is so bad that that it fails, thus by adding a ground wire you are simply regrounding the T/B? That makes sense to me.
Im in the process of installing my ride rite air bags and compressor so I will have to ohm out my t/b to see.

 

[electriccity]

Well I did this...I still need a couple of test drives to prove weather or not anything has happend.
The circuit should be grounded internally back to the computer...

 

[CdnoilRAM]

I have one thing to say about this thread and this mod (in this post) and that is:

 

[RamTex]

Dont hate you hater!!! There are a lot more threads out there than this at least this is creative...

 

[CdnoilRAM]

And here are the quotes from my other forum regarding this exact same mod that is being stupidly circulated and then endorsed by the 'butt dyno'.

You do realize the throttle body ground is internal and isolated from the throttle body itself right? you can run a 2" ground bus off the throttle body and it will have no effect

There isn't one electronic item within that tb that directly references ground. 31 is 1000% right. You want a improvement, then upgrade the ground from the bellhousing to the chassis grnd. Everything else is bs.

What are you guys thinking?? You've both been here long enough to realize science is no match for the ass dyno...

You guys aren't for real are you???

I've read some doozies in my time...but this b0llsh!t really takes the cake. We just get everyone understanding just how ineffective / useless hypergrounding is and now this?

As some really smart folks have already(!) stated, signal reference ground (GND) is internal and NOT subject to extraneous EMI / RFI of any sort. Add to this there is a +reference voltage. Good heavens folks, this is not only pointless but stupid...


EDIT; a mindlessly simple means of debunking this farce would be with an oscilliscope on either GND or one of the + references...

EDIT #2; try and imagine (my goodness) if our throttle control-by-wire systems on our rides were actually subject to any sort of extraneous noise or anomalies during command and/or reference sampling...it would make the previous "unintended acceleration" fiasco look like a walk in the park.

EDIT #3; then there's the reference-V itself that confirms physical blade position back to the PCM...if "anything" is outta line it's reported immediately and swift action is taken (limp mode with no throttle recovery and DTC's).

than just a hypothesis...same with installing a ported throttle body and being "instructed" to remove B- or pull fuse 11. Simply resetting the adaptives in most cases results in significant drivability changes...without changing a single component

Adding extra grounds carries some significant risks BTW; as opposed to me blathering on about it, google "ground loop" and take note how easy it is to screw / compromise another electrical system or circuitry integrity by inducing voltage / current in other devices.

There's no question that having sufficient ground is important for any modern engine. However, taking a particular instance, and expanding it as a generality does not make logical sense. Something else has to be going on to influence the electronics and servo motor in the TB. I typically use grounding to complete an electrical circuit or to provide shielding from EMI (electro-magnetic interfence). For example, I have a grounding wire attached to the housing of the MSD box in my '92 Explorer, among other things that MSD recommends as electrical protection. The operative word is here is recommends, meaning that MSD has including the grounding wire as part of its troubleshooting guide, because it may be required.

From my perspective, a grounding wire off the TB implies that something is amiss with the TB electronics that is causing the reported issue, like EMI, which can hasten the degeneration of electrical components (depending on severity). If this is the case, then TB grounding is a solution for the particular instance, and not something that is generally or universally recommended. To Eric's and Simon's point, the TB is directly controlled by the PCM/ECU as a closed system. The housing of the TB could be plastic and the electronics would still work. That said, all electronic components are prone to degeneration over time due to heat, but the TB electronics have been "engineered" for it's particular environmental conditions. That's not to say, however, that sh!t never happen.

What is important to realize is that any sort of anomaly within the confines of the TB electronics or servo control system are constantly monitored for position fidelity and accuracy. Any anomaly that would alter blade position to produce an unwanted change from commanded position is not possible without it being sensed and acted upon by the PCM. After all, this is what is being implied here...that somehow throttle blade angle is being modified by adding a GND lead (wire = one conductive strand, lead = bundle of strands, cable = 2 or more leads).

these topics have been discused ad-nasuem many times over. the reason why the seasoned people chime in here is because of how much snake oil is being sold and taking advantage of the members who just dont know what they are looking for. the search function can find all these topics.

i think the knowledge base needs to be expanded on these snake oil tricks, for the purpose of consumer protection.

but to answer the question at hand in laymans terms. one good ground = least resistance. electricity follows the path of least resistance, just like a stream of water. adding a bunch of little creeks in the middle of the stream creates a pool of water, or in electrical terms, resistance... heat

must equally realize though that these sorts of things can lead to other problems, or mask the actual problem...and just plain not be functional. With respect to the OP's opinion that he believes has been corrected by adding a length of lead; I'm confident that upon further investigation either root-cause would be determined and / or the added lead is ineffective.

Let's be clear...the suggestion or implication is that adding a length of lead from vehicle GND to the TB's aluminum shell has altered throttle body functionality. This has been disproven and a means of corroborating outlined (measure signal integrity looking for extraneous noise on-signal or references with an oscilloscope). Add to this that it has been shown that if "any" anomaly exists, for any measureable length of time (milliseconds) will be immediately flagged by the PCM.

This is not about whether a red car is better than a white car. That is purely subjective. It is whether the act of adding a length of lead can do what is being claimed. The results being suggested are subjective.

It can not...and what has been put forth to support this...is empirical.

 

[CdnoilRAM]

Dont hate you hater!!! There are a lot more threads out there than this at least this is creative...

Creative or not, doesn't mean this does ANYTHING. Our TBs are internally grounded through the wiring harness and if there was any static charge being built up on the TB, it is dissipated through the internal ground. I see so many people recommend ressetting the adaptives and you'll see the difference with this mod... OF COURSE YOU WILL YOU RESET THE ADAPTIVES! there by altering the internal memory of throttle blade neutral. That's like saying "if you want to go fast, roll down the window" because it FEELS faster.

 

[electriccity]

I agree that this has to do nothing. In fact like I stated and was stated above the throttle body actuator is internally grounded...You could disconnect the throttle body from the intake all together and let it hang there and still open and close the thottle plate with a scan tool...that being said...I still did it...why...because A) I had to take my hemi air plate section off anyway to clean out some debris on the intake and B) its just a piece of wire why not...lol but alas if it where only that easy.

 

[RamTex]

If people are getting a "noticeable" difference with this mod that is basically free it should at least be tried? And... that i understand all the cons are backed up with no permanent evidence other than saying its nothing but pipe dreams and complete BS... And that the way its being proven has been nothing but from personal experiences and nothing else. To prove this wrong someone needs to officially test the fact that the factory ground is or is not doing its job. Not by calling it complete BS.

 

[CdnoilRAM]

The problem with the idea of a 'free mod' just because it can be done (and yes, this does work on limited vehicles, popular on some import intakes with poor grounding I've been told; this is due to having internal processing) has a bad tendancy to create the placebo effect. Too many people go on the 'butt dyno' which means if they did a mod, they want to FEEL a result, which in all too common a case is exactely what they WANT to feel. Then it perpetuates itself, since one person did it, followed by others, then suddenly it becomes the 'IT' mod to do... like throttle body spacers.

If they are seeing a 'difference' then there is potential for there being a real underlying cause, which this mod would then be treating a symptom, not the disease. I wrapped and grounded my RCA leads on my pioneer HU because i have alternator whine, and it went away. I know it went away, but I did not solve the underlying cause of having a blown internal fuse, I just covered up the symptom.

Our TB mechanisms are not subject to RFI or EMI, so the concept of grounding out the housing to improve throttle signal clarity can not be taken seriously. If our TBs had internal chip boards I could see this possibility, but when you have a wire connected to a servo motor, which drives a dead arm, there is zero possibility of EM interference.

 

[MartinJD]

I just rigged up the TB ground wire mod myself and got nothin. I do however have a pretty blue wire under my hood now to match the rest of my truck!

 

[RamTex]

You are not listening i could car less if it works or not... The mod has not been disproven or proved the facts are unknown. Just by saying a hole bunch of stuff that has nothing to do with the mod doesn't "PROVE" anything. It takes actual tests of the entire system to say that what people are and arent experiencing is false?